Bullies, Suicides and dumb principals

[Head Elf]

I don't know what's going on in today's world but it is really frightening to hear and see. I have kids that think they have no self worth and want to kill themselves or self mutilate. I read on the forum that children are being bullied and it's ok by their parents to act like this. I would love to say bad parenting but I can't. Society is to blame just as much as the toxic environment those people live in. I was bullied and a bully, so I have seen it from both sides. I was bullied because I have red hair and freckles and I didn't look like everyone else. I bullied because of the power and the thrill it gave me. But I didn't use physical force in school, I used the mental side of it because that was what I learned from my parents. Sad, but true. I grew up knowing that there were no do overs (dead is dead). I knew what reality was and what was a cartoon. I do believe in corp. punishment and I think that responsiblity and accountability need to be taught and inforced in the schools. Teachers and schools are not babysitters, children should feel safe in that environment as should the teachers. Children that don't follow rules should be punished and if the parents don't like it, tough cookies. I'd rather have parents mad then dead students or kids that think suicide is the answer. For those of you that have read my latest thread about my students or all of the deaths in the last month, I just found out that one more decided he couldn't deal with the pressure and feeling all alone and he hung himself last Thursday. I found out today and the funeral is tomorrow. I am so angry that I could spit nickels, nails etc. I know we are don't have a Leave it to Beaver life anymore, but something has to change. We are all unique and individual and a gift from above. We each have a talent or gift and we each need to be treasured. The principal in Texas needs to pull their head out and think about his charges (students/teachers) and realize that his way is jeopardizing many children and families. Let's hope he isn't the next school shooting on T.V.
Sorry about the ranting and raving, had to vent.

[Jeff Westover]

I feel your pain. We lost a neighbor kid in this fashion a few years back.

But there is blame a-plenty to go around.

First of all, schools, for as bad as they are now, have really ham-strung teachers. Teachers are so afraid to act due to lawsuits and claims of abuse. Administrators are absolutely paralyzed due to fear of litigation and bad press. Kids who a generation before wouldn't be allowed to be in schools practically run the places now.

2nd, too many parents, doctors AND ESPECIALLY teachers are turning to medication to manage kids. These meds have serious side effects ESPECIALLY suicide. There simply aren't as many ADD or ADHD kids are are being diagnosed. These kids don't need medication, they need their mothers and they need present, engaged fathers. Full time, all the time, year round, from age zero to 19. Period.

3rd, parents can learn to say "no". Standards are standards. You DON'T have to let your kids pick their own friends. You DON'T have to allow them to listen, read or watch whatever they want. It is ok to say NO. In fact, kids like it more when you do. They feel that thing called love when you do that.

My heart breaks for what you're going through. We have been there in the most intimate way and we know precisely what it is like. Give your heart to those directly affected but take those lessons home and don't let down your guard.

[trackrebel]

Jeff You are so right about the ADD thing.....it happens so much over here in Germany as well.....I am sure there are some children who require the meds.....but not close as many as it is done these days....The diagnose of Attention Deficite Syndrom has gone through the roof in the last few years....seems like Doctor´s are throwing around with recipes (we get recipes to go the pharmacy and get the medication) for Ritalin and that stuff around them......I think it´s highly dangerous...and more and more people are starting to see the problem....I hope they will do something about it!

[snowytree]

When I hear stories about these kids that commit suicide, the first thing I think is...where are the parents? I'm certainly not trying to be judgemental here but did they not see anything going on with their child? I know we are not perfect but we need to try and stay in tune with our children as much as possible and pay attention,and mostly listen and communicate. I communicate with my children everyday...sure they may get sick of mom being so in touch with them so much,but I'd rather them know that Im there so they know they can come to me when they are going through anything, and I do mean anything.

[JanaBanana]

Yes, i agree that ADD is way over diagnosed...sometimes a spanking is in order.Its very sad what many children have to endure...breaks my heart. I have been there..my children are my world and its my job to protect them. I can see why some parents homeschool. I wish I could at times....

[Christmas Snow Angel]

Society and bad parenting are to blame! It upsets me soo badly hear stories of bullying or suicides. I get fired up when I'm in the store and see a 3 year old telling mom and dad what to do and they do it. Parents need to stop being friends and start parenting. Sure your kids may dislike you for a short period of time but they'll thank you a lifetime later on in life.
MOST principals and teachers are afraid to discipline their students because it may come back as bad publicity on the School Board. They're scared of being fired and sued. If people would put as much time into making sure theres a safe and healthy enviroment as they do about caring what other people think we'd have a wonderful school system and better parents.
We as parents need to step up and take a good look at our children. Make sure your children know they are loved and supported. Let them know it's ok to talk about their problems with you. Look at your childrens friends, and get to know them. IF every parent took the extra step kids today would be soo much better off and the world would be a better place. Parents today can be soo lazy when it comes to parenting. UGH!! :-?

[ReineV]

Before my second oldest sister became an administrator in the Atlanta BoE, she was a teacher for about 7 years. She had several students who she had been told had "learning disabilities" and ADD. Once she got them and basically told them she didn't take no mess...they didn't seem to have ADD anymore! They were calm, attentive, and with a lot of help and tutoring, excelled in their studies. But she loved being a teacher and was willing to stay after school and help students if they needed her. So many teachers end up just going into teaching because they feel they have nothing else they can do or they feel that's the only job they can get. With teaching, your heart has to be in it because the money and the circumstances surrounding your job aren't all that great! My mom owns a preschool, my middle sister is now an administrator, my dad and two of his brothers are retired principals and two of my cousins are teachers...I contemplated becoming one myself, but I love writing!

One ongoing problem they all kept encountering was the parents lack of involvement and responsibility for their child. I understand it takes a village, but in today's world, you don't know how trustworthy some of the village residents are! Which is why I think we can only trust ourselves and our families to raise our own children. Schools are overcrowded in so many areas, and unfortunately, teachers don't have the time or the resources to take over the job of raising the children, they barely have time to teach them because they spend most of their day trying to wrangle 35-40 kids in. Our public school systems are horribly broken and dysfunctional. We need smaller class sizes so that teachers will actually be able to give each child the attention they need in order to succeed as well as detect problems students might be having before it's too late. One of my friends little brothers was in 9th grade and ended up committing suicide and no one had no idea it was coming. Had teachers actually been able to observe their class room and interact with their students instead of yelling at them from the chalk board, it might have been different.

[JOHNOR]

i despair of the way this world is going, and yes jana, i agree. sometimes spanking IS needed. all this "molly coddling" and "wrapping up in cotton wool" that goes on is ridiculous. if a child is persistently disobedient and you have tried to talk to him/her and resolve the situation, yet they still aren't listening, then a good old fashioned spank/smack is perfectly acceptable in my opinion.

90% of all problems is because of the parents and society.

over here in britain, a few months ago a single parent father who was a volunteer (working with kids) was having a tough time with his daughter. she was staying out late, answering back and being a general pain in the butt. one night he looked out of his window to see if she was on her way home (it was really late) and he seen her banging on her neighbours door and running away laughing. he was furious, ran outside and gave her a slap across the face. she rang the police and now he cannot volunteer working with children anymore??????? what the heck???????? the little brat deserved it! he explained he has tried talking to her/grounding her etc.. and he was at the end of his tether. needless to say she is a well behaved girl now.

also, a friend of mine is a teacher, she asked one her pupils (16 year old) to move out of the way so she could pass her. the girl responded with "who the **** are you talking to? i'll get you shot if you ever speak to me like that again" SHOT???? what is this world coming to? the girl only got 5 days suspension! and her parents do not care. in my opinion, that is why she is the way she is - her parents, and also the fact that the school just let her get away with it.

[ReineV]

I agree with the spanking too. My moms school is a Christian academy and she gets written permission from the parents to spank children of a certain age. She explains to them the process, the "Rod of Correction" aka "Roc" and how many times a child has to get in trouble before a spanking is received. If the parents disagree with her, she will refuse to enroll the child! Before my mom even considers enrolling a child, she conducts an interview with the parents and the child(s). If the child is running around, screaming, saying "No" and being generally disobedient, she'll wait to see what the parent does, then tell them what they might need to do next time. If the parent is open and receptive to the advice, she'll consider them, if not, they're out the door!

It's crazy what I've seen kids today get away with! My mom only had to spank me a total of 3 times in my life...you know why? Cause that woman put the fear of GOD in me!! I knew not to speak when adults were speaking, I knew to respect my elders and I knew if I ever...ever talked back, that might be the last thing I ever said! Compared to my sisters, I was the "bad" one. They only got spanked once or twice each because she had us all lined up straight! She had to run a tight ship though because my parents were divorced and she had to work full time and be a mom full time. We all turned out pretty ok too! 3 girls= one doctor, one teacher/school administrator, one writer (me!). My mommy is my hero :)

[JOHNOR]

reine - your mum has clearly done a wonderful job. the world needs more parents like her.

i too received a smack from my mum if i ever stepped out of line, my dad never smacked me, because he didn't need to. just a look was enough. we were taught to have the utmost respect for him and not to dare answer back. i have turned out pretty good, i have respect for my elders and the people around me and i have good, decent morals and manners.

[trackrebel]

When I hear stories about these kids that commit suicide, the first thing I think is...where are the parents? I'm certainly not trying to be judgemental here but did they not see anything going on with their child? I know we are not perfect but we need to try and stay in tune with our children as much as possible and pay attention,and mostly listen and communicate. I communicate with my children everyday...sure they may get sick of mom being so in touch with them so much,but I'd rather them know that Im there so they know they can come to me when they are going through anything, and I do mean anything.


kind of true....kinda not....I agree, that many parents don´t really know what is going on with their children...they never scold them...give them a lil slap....nothing....they might not even talk to them.....so it´s no wonder they don´t know....

when I was 14-15....I had some slight depression....it was going on for over a year until my mom saw a change in me....of course, she then took me to a doctor who was helping a bit....and it was fine.....and she was a parent who knew and still knows everything about me....and I would talk to about everything...but in that case....I just put up a wall....and wore a mask....and acted like I was aaaalright!!! I wasn´t....so sometimes it´s impossible to do anything....but a lot of miserys could be prevented if people in general...espeically the parents....but everybody surrounding children would pay more attention.

[Head Elf]

All of you are stating what I say to the administration. But with their hands tied because of the "friviolous" law suits and everyone wanting the easy dollar, it is difficult to proceed. I remember having to write standards or getting the paddle if I did something wrong. I lived in a small town and heaven forbid if I did something that would get back to my grandmother. If it embarassed her, we were really in trouble. I remember having respect for my teachers and/or elders. I didn't call my teachers by just their last name, we usually called them Coach and last name or Mr. or Mrs., Ms, or Miss. These kids today have no respect or shame. Why are we dressing little girls like little tramps (sorry). Why are we letting this happen. I know so many parents that are afraid of their own kids. I know that up to the day that my mom passed I was afraid of her, I had a deep respect for that woman. I have this one teacher that wants to quit because of some of her students. Our Student Council walked out of their leadership class because they don't get along with the advisor. They walked into the principals office and told him to get rid of her. It's her first year in this position and the principal accepted what these Brats were saying. In school suspension isn't working anymore (free ride), out of school suspension hits the family and they can't afford to take time off to babysit their own kids. Half the time the student handbook is nothing more than an excuse. So, since school has started we have had a suicide every two weeks about. Most of the time I think it's a ploy for attention and unfortunately it doesn't come. Most of these kids do something to get the negative attention because their parents don't care. For these kids (my high school) they are dorm kids from the reservation and their parents get money to put them in town. That way out of sight out of mind. It really is a shame when parents just throw away kids, it's almost as bad as abortion. We need to bring back parenting. Even the idea of holding the parents when their kids are truant isn't working. Again, thank you for your words and I know I'm not the only one out there with this problem. Maybe we can come up with something that the politicians haven't thought of (yet).

[yuletide]

It was a horrible experience. The kids hated him because he skipped a grade. (he had to iq is 160 and he was bored bigtime) we never told anyone about his iq or anything. They just could tell I guess. One day when he was getting a drink out of the water fountain - they shoved his head into it and broke off his 2 front teeth. (adult teeth) The school didn't do much - the parents lied to me. I called and they said that their child went to school the next day and apologized and talked to my son to be really sorry. I let them go on and on - basically let them hang themselves.....then I said "Oh that's odd - he spent the day at the dentists office and did not even go to school...." So, the moral of the the story is - the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. Stupid is as stupid does or rather, stupid is as stupid breeds.
Yule

[Head Elf]

I don't believe in Bullies at all.... I always one for the underdog. I don't like people what ever the age is picking on those that are don't match up to their standards. I'm tired of schools being a daycare instead of a learning institution. I'm tired of all the parents that want to hide their heads and not take action for their children. I understand that depression is dangerous and most kids today don't have someone that they can trust to talk to. I am happy for those children that do have parents that talk to them, laugh with them and discipline them and along with all that cry with them when they hurt. So many of today's kids are screaming for help and no one is listening. I know I can't save all the kids in my school, but they need to be told that they are viable, unique and be applauded for the individuality that they have. Most of the kids at my school dress in black and they think they are making a statement. I tell them that they are hiding. If they wanted to be a piece of the school, they need to wear colorful clothes and be a chameleon. Schools have their hands tied because of their board of supervisors. Most of them have forgotten what it is like to be an educator as well as a student.

I am sorry for all those children that have been bullied or will be bullied because they don't fit the status quo. I pity the bullies because one day someone bigger and badder is going to hurt them (again). I despise the parents of the bullies because they are the ones screaming that life isn't giving their kids any justice. I'm glad I'm 50 and almost done with my life (40years from now). Most of these kids can't even boil water and they are our future? Help......

[Faith4always]

This is one reason why we home school our children.
It hasn't been an easy road, but it's been a necessary one.
My sister taught in the public school system for years and years. She finally had enough, pulled her own child out of public school and began home schooling him.
I also think it's a sad day when our valadictorians in the public schools - go to college and have to take remedial math and english courses. Yes.
There have been teachers here in Louisiana that begin the school year with "I don't want to be here anymore than you. So, let's just get through this the best we can."
If the parents were training, loving, caring for, raising their children, and lovingly disciplining their children at home - I think it starts at home....and if the parents would allow the schools to properly discipline children at school - I think things would turn around and change.
I honestly don't believe in child abuse. But I do believe in spankings.
As far as the bullies, what's going on in that child(s) life to make him a bully. Is s/he being loved on at home? or put down? Does s/he even have a decent home life? I look at the whole thing before making a judgement call on it. Like the parents of the bully who knocked that poor little guy's teeth out - THAT is NOT okay. Their flippant attitude. Then I think, maybe they're ignoring the problem because they're scared and they honestly don't know how to handle the child OR the situation.
The schools are not there to RAISE the children. That's the parents job.
The school are there to teach your kids how to read, write, and do math.
Okay. I guess I'm right there with the majority so far.

[snowytree]

I don't believe in Bullies at all.... I always one for the underdog. I don't like people what ever the age is picking on those that are don't match up to their standards. I'm tired of schools being a daycare instead of a learning institution. I'm tired of all the parents that want to hide their heads and not take action for their children. I understand that depression is dangerous and most kids today don't have someone that they can trust to talk to. I am happy for those children that do have parents that talk to them, laugh with them and discipline them and along with all that cry with them when they hurt. So many of today's kids are screaming for help and no one is listening. I know I can't save all the kids in my school, but they need to be told that they are viable, unique and be applauded for the individuality that they have. Most of the kids at my school dress in black and they think they are making a statement. I tell them that they are hiding. If they wanted to be a piece of the school, they need to wear colorful clothes and be a chameleon. Schools have their hands tied because of their board of supervisors. Most of them have forgotten what it is like to be an educator as well as a student.

I am sorry for all those children that have been bullied or will be bullied because they don't fit the status quo. I pity the bullies because one day someone bigger and badder is going to hurt them (again). I despise the parents of the bullies because they are the ones screaming that life isn't giving their kids any justice. I'm glad I'm 50 and almost done with my life (40years from now). Most of these kids can't even boil water and they are our future? Help......

I'm saying Amen to this!

[ReineV]

I was bullied in middle school...what is with that age?! Children really can be cruel if they don't have the proper home training. For some reason, the fact that I had really really long hair made me an odd ball. I used to wear it in either one thick braid or a ponytail and there was this group of kids who would just yank my hair. I remember getting on the bus in the morning and having to be careful about wear I sat because if I sat in front of the wrong person, they'd reach over the seat and violently snatch my ponytail back as if they were trying to rip it right off my head! Needless to say, it got so bad that my mom transferred me to another school to start high school and I cut a few inches of my hair off. I kept it shorter than it was in middle school until after graduating from college. I'm just now starting to grow it back!

Come to find out, these were some deeply troubled people. I know a couple of the bulliers ended up getting hooked on drugs and have been in and out of jail. I don't think they completed high school.